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Who would you like to see win on June 8?

  • Conservatives

    Votes: 68 37.4%
  • Labour

    Votes: 68 37.4%
  • Lib Dems

    Votes: 27 14.8%
  • SNP/Plaid Cymru/Other home country type party

    Votes: 8 4.4%
  • Greens

    Votes: 7 3.8%
  • Other (MRL, standing at the back dressed stupidly and looking stupid party, or whoever)

    Votes: 4 2.2%

Oh Snap! General election poll and discussion

56K views 819 replies 71 participants last post by  Triplefive F 
#1 · (Edited)
Let's see if we can do a better job than ComRes and their ilk at predicting the outcome of this.

The usual, mostly pointless, plea to keep it civil when calling each other ignorami for our political views should be taken as read.
 
#73 ·
Perhaps because as business minded people, (capitalists) they at least understand that you have to have a good economic landscape, to provide the levels of employment, salaries, taxation to underpin a welfare state and health service etc.

The Socialists seem to think you can provide a welfare state and NHS by continually dipping into a bottomless magic money well, and seek to encourage voters by empty, but warming sound bites like - greater social fairness, provide for the needy, equality for all, etc, etc, etc - which is absolutely wonderful, and I would vote for them all day long - if only they could come up with any kind of workable plan to achieve it.

New Labour under Blair was the closest they came to appearing sensible - and look how that worked out.
 
#80 ·
In other news, apparently ITV have confirmed, and the Beeb are to folllow suit, that they will go ahead with televised debates even if May refuses to participate.

I'm not entirely sure that will hurt her. It's better to stay silent and let people think you might be a fool than speak and remove all doubt, as they say.
 
#94 ·
Policies / election manifestos :lol::lol: Don't make me laugh.

Be it Labour or Conservatives they'll get elected on "manifesto" promises and then find some snidey way to backtrack and not carry them out...

How many years has that been going on and most of the population still can't see it.

The world at the moment is a dangerous place but only because of a very "very" small group of people. I bet if somehow you could sit down in front of every one in the world and asked if they wanted peace, harmony and to live without conflict 99.9% of the population would say yes.

Sorry, went off on a tangent then :lol:
 
#97 ·
Like most people ( I think ) this poses a dilemma for me, I have 'socialist' leanings but the last Labour Party
leader I had confidence in was a long time ago ( John Smith who died quite young ); they lost their way when
the closet Tory ( Tony Blair ) was just a disciple of extending the "loads a money" Thatcher doctrine that has
shaped our materialistic society. And now Corbyn who is'nt even wanted by his own party.....go figure!!!.
Problem is - what is the alternative ?, I share the views that the Tories really represent the chosen few, with a
bit of kid-ology to attract the middle class ( aspiring to be one of the chosen few ) to vote them/keep them in,
But who they represent are the wealth generators.
Lib-Dem / Green / Others ?, most seem to be idealists rather than realists , might appeal to the those who are
comfortable enough to feel benevolent but hardly likely to ring true with people who are struggling week to week?.
So right now it really is a dilemma , and why the Polls / Betting are predicting a huge Tory majority - people just don't see a viable alternative............sorry rambled on a bit there!!
 
#114 ·
"We are not the establishment" proclaims a bloke who has drawn a Westminster wage whilst doing nothing for over thirty years.

He's full on rolled out the Trump playbook, 'the system is rigged, the media is rigged'. I don't think May will go after him too heavily- she can win well and if she's really lucky he'll keep his job.
 
#116 ·
My read on this is that "May" had to call a snap election (and win) to give her a firmer mandate on the "Brexit" situation.

Considering she got the Prime Minister position without the popular vote and only from the MP's she (and) any Tory leader would have been given a "poison chalice" to carry Brexit out without this.

Fair play to her, she's putting up and saying to the UK "Back me"

I'll be interested to see how this plays out.
 
#118 ·
Kamikaze politics.

That really is pathetic.

It is akin to sabotaging the election, instead of stopping the Tories by coming up with something better. Like a workable alternative that would give hope of a better future.

Like the rich, horrible, spoiled kid that punctures the football if the others don't roll over and let him win.
 
#154 ·
That's surprisingly low.
Yeah, I guess it's all to easy to slip into stereotypes about politicians and their educational background. Probably more important to assess what they do now, rather than where they went to school in the past?
 
#156 ·
Yeah, I guess it's all to easy to slip into stereotypes about politicians and their educational background. Probably more important to assess what they do now, rather than where they went to school in the past?
This is no place for that sort of revolutionary talk.

Whilst we are talking numbers/percentages , good summary article on the parties in today's (i newspaper) :-
Party memberships -
Labour 520,000
Tories 150,000
SNP 120,000
LD 95,000
Women's Equality 65,000
Green 45,000
UKIP 36,000
Plaid Cymru 8,200
Total - 1,039,200
Quite small numbers really, considering the total UK population ( tens of millions ) , must admit surprised
me that so few are in some way 'politically active' - and running the country!!!!!
Wow, the Women's Equality party have exploded out of the blocks - they were only formed about two years ago. Reassuring that they're nearly double the size of UKIP.
 
#121 ·
Complacency because there is no viable opposition and the feeling that its a foregone conclusion is exactly what will loose the election for the Conservatives.

The fact that Labour is dis functional means nothing to the voters who want change, the EU referendum should make it obvious that people will vote with their hearts, I think the turnout will be high because the people who dont tend to bother learned that they really can make a difference recently.

This is Jeremy Corbyns big chance and I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him win.
 
#123 ·
So many people keep coming out with the mantra that Labour is dysfunctional...it's no more dysfunctional than the Tory party. It's not a reason not to vote for them any more than it is a reason to vote for the cons. Vote for the policies, not the personalities.
 
#133 ·
So many people keep coming out with the mantra that Labour is dysfunctional...it's no more dysfunctional than the Tory party.
I think they are miles are apart from each other on the dysfunctional scale.
Just take the fiasco after the Brexit vote, the Tories got themselves sorted out and back in political business by putting May in charge in a matter of days, whilst the labour party were still arguing for weeks about Corbyn's suitability as leader with the subsequent leadership challenge months later, numerous resignations from the shadow cabinet, even now a number of the labour MP's have been reported as not standing for election in June due to their differences to the current party line. And that's aside from all the party anti-semitism & racism allegations.

I think the next election is sadly a foregone conclusion and just hope the Labour Party can get themselves sorted afterwards. But I think they are going to have to get rid of Corbyn and his types in leadership and head back towards a more centre ground left.
 
#125 ·
There should be no need to vote tactically for a party that is not of your choice, just to stop a party you hate from getting in, even though you acknowledge that more people would vote for them than any of the others.

It smacks of - if I can't have my favourite soup, then I will piss in the soup and spoil it for everyone.

Ultimately, it is those respective parties that have failed their supporters by not coming up with a popular manifesto that can be supported by a big enough segment of the voting public.
Yet, folk seem unable to switch allegiance.
Quite unlike real political thinking, and more like football supporter mentality, that beat up folk that are wearing the 'wrong' colour hat on a Saturday - pathetic.
 
#127 ·
There should be no need to vote tactically for a party that is not of your choice, just to stop a party you hate from getting in, even though you acknowledge that more people would vote for them than any of the others.
No... more people would vote for NOT the Tories, but the Tories would get in anyway because the people who didn't vote for them would be divided between a couple of other parties who are essentially variations on a theme.

In 2015 the Tories got less than 25% of the national vote but a majority of seats because the other votes were split between everyone else. So the overwhelming majority wanted NOT the tories, but got them anyway. It's like the crisps analogy for the single transferable vote from the electoral reform referendum.

If your mate is going to the shops for you and asks what you want, you say ready salted crisps, he goes off, there aren't any ready salted crisps so instead he pick up some dog shit on the way home and gives you that. 'I didn't want dog shit!' you say, 'yeah but they were out of ready salted crisps, so I had to improvise' he replies.

You then discover that the shop has taken to only ordering very small quantities of ready salted crisps but they've always got loads of salt and vinegar. So the next time your mate goes to the shop and asks what you want do you say ready salted, which you really want but know there's a high chance they'll be out of and he'll probably pick up some dog shit on the way home, or say salt and a vinegar because you know they'll have it and at least it's still fit for human consumption?
 
#126 ·
Excellent thread -I think it clearly illustrates the dilemma we are all in , we all want a fairer/more inclusive society but have ( mostly) lost confidence in "politicians' ( right or left ) to deliver such an elusive solution.
I am old enough to have witnessed the massive rate of change in our society over the last 70 years and
what occurs to me is the only thing that has'nt changed ( to keep up ) is the political set up - we are still
looking at the same "party of the upper class verses the party of the working class ".
Maybe, just maybe , the apparent rise of the populist vote ( EU Referendum / Trump / maybe France etc.)
is the will of the people demanding that change , though worryingly the outcomes appear to be more right
wing in essence...........It has happened before during economic crisis periods!!!.
 
#135 ·
Well it was an excellent thread....

Excellent thread -I think it clearly illustrates the dilemma we are all in , we all want a fairer/more inclusive society but have ( mostly) lost confidence in "politicians' ( right or left ) to deliver such an elusive solution.
I am old enough to have witnessed the massive rate of change in our society over the last 70 years and
what occurs to me is the only thing that has'nt changed ( to keep up ) is the political set up - we are still
looking at the same "party of the upper class verses the party of the working class" scenario.

Maybe, just maybe , the apparent rise of the populist vote ( EU Referendum / Trump / maybe France etc.)
is the will of the people demanding that change , though worryingly the outcomes appear to be more right
wing in essence...........It has happened before during economic crisis periods!!!.
..................................
Immediately I said what a good thread this was , with varying views - it rapidly degenerated into attacking people's honest opinions. As I keep saying it is a big dilemma we face and no
clear silver bullet choices....IMHO?
 
#138 ·
the trouble with tory vs labour is that labour will always have a mix of users who disagree with each other.

fptp has forced us into an almost US style 2 party system. the tories always seem to be united because they have a common mantra of 'privatise all the things', and this is a very low-effort policy because it relies on leaving everything to 'the market'.

to oppose this means to undo the mess that the last 30 years have gotten us into. the traditional left/labour approach can't work because too much of the state has been sold off and there is no way to raise enough in taxes to put us back to where we were. being pragmatic means that labour will always have mix of people with different ideas of how we go about shifting the running of the country back to the left. hence they always seem to be 'a shambles'.

if we had pr then we could have an array of left leaning parties, which would be more likely to govern in coalition. or at least present a more effective opposition.

(imo. i don't believe in party politics and i really don't understand how a 'party whip' can be considered legal in a democracy.)
 
#139 ·
The trouble with most political thinking is that it's too short term, and barely tinkers with the edges of the major issues such as the NHS, infrastructure, public transport, housing, social welfare etc. rather than really tackling them. Fear paralysis real progress and change!

If you stick a knife in my back nine inches and pull it out six inches, there's no progress. If you pull it all the way out that's not progress. Progress is healing the wound that the blow made. And they haven't even pulled the knife out much less heal the wound. They won't even admit the knife is there… Malcom X
 
#140 ·
I think the conservatives will roll it, May looks like a strong leader as long as it doesn't go to her head like Thatcher.
SNP will dominate Scotland, Labour will get seats in Wales don't ask me why ! I'll vote PC as Wales should do like Scotland.
My prediction Conservative, LD's , SNP, and last place Labour. I think If Wales does go with PC, it will be the end of the Labour Party as we know it.
 
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