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Aircooled Mechanical Tech A Q & A Forum devoted to Aircooled Mechanical Issues. Got a problem? Then ask in here. Please, no 'For Sale' or 'Want To Buy' ads, plugs for your 'business', links to 'for sale' ads or Ebay links to your (or your mate's) auction (use the VZi 'Classifieds' section) - this also includes thinly veiled 'What's My Car Worth?' threads and "Who Can Sell Me A . . ." posts.

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Old 21-05-2019, 09:37 PM   #11
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Breif update. I had set the bottom ball joints at opposite offsets. So I expct that has entirely cocked things up, ive yet to drive it. Id no idea which way is the correct way to have them until I go and recover and old one ( i think there is one in a box of front axel bits in the parents shed). But the fact theyre both the same is a pluss, if it doesnt work ill just spin them the other way. Progress, maybe?
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Old 22-05-2019, 07:40 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by broady_6 View Post
Breif update. I had set the bottom ball joints at opposite offsets. So I expct that has entirely cocked things up, ive yet to drive it. Id no idea which way is the correct way to have them until I go and recover and old one ( i think there is one in a box of front axel bits in the parents shed). But the fact theyre both the same is a pluss, if it doesnt work ill just spin them the other way. Progress, maybe?
That sounds very likely! Good find.
I got mine back together lst night and it drives straight now so those 2 broken springs did it for me.

[Edit : more driving and...nope, still pull left, looking at rears next but I will stop poluting this thread now. ]

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Old 22-05-2019, 10:34 AM   #13
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I used the bob weight fron the same location of each side of the front beam shock towers and then the lowest bolt hole ear of the rear torsion tube and then also from each bolt centre of the framehorns.
I was then able to check the chassis was square and not kinked or accident damaged. Then once satisfied with this it was easy enough to find the centre line but even then once the line was drawn on the concrete I double checked by finding the centre measurement on the floorpan of all the bob weight marked locations and hung the bob weight from this centre line to see if it matched with the centre line drawn on the concrete.
This does require a pretty darn level concrete floor and is time consuming but being able to check for chassis squareness meant any probelms were down to not setting the alignment properly or a faulty suspension part.
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Old 22-05-2019, 09:30 PM   #14
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That sounds very likely! Good find.
I got mine back together lst night and it drives straight now so those 2 broken springs did it for me.

[Edit : more driving and...nope, still pull left, looking at rears next but I will stop poluting this thread now. ]
Bugger, you aren't polluting at all. Its all discussion on topic, and it may be that tangential thought which brings about the answer.

I corrected (or so I thought, but more on that later) the ball joint. They are at least symmetrical now and its 90% better. I didn't realise the type 3 effectively has adjustable caster. Im about to update my thread but ill drag the info over here too as a reference incase anyone else comes up against this issue.

psimitar, thank you for the details. certainly something I will be giving a go
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Old 22-05-2019, 09:54 PM   #15
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As promised

Lets see if my descriptive powers and rough sketches can explain this then.

I suspected the issue lay with the bottom ball joints, as theyre eccentric ive since realised this effectively gives adjustable caster.

Remembering I had a set of old arms at my parents I popped in this evening and collected them, just to get my hands on the old ball joints. This joints have the groove in them, where as my febi replacements didnt have a groove in them for alignmen, thus not giving me and clue how to orientate them. Always prefering to understand what and why im digging a littler deeper than "line this notch up with a mark because the manual says to" I wanted to know what the orientation is when things were lined up.

The manual states these are to be installed with this cut out facing forwards. This is a very old but original ball join, you can see the notch in the top.



Two steps back, using these highly accurate technical drawings, clearly I didnt remember to set this up when I installed them. This is how the car was set.



Once this had been realised I rotated one to get the offset symetrical.



With me so far? I know those complex drawings are hard to understand!

I then took a look at an original item. You can see here its clearly and ofset backways which i believe is supposed to provide some positve caster.



I drove the car this evening with the ball joints in the symetrical set up and it is 90% better, theres a slight left pull. But its next to nothing by comparison to the previous set up.

Obviously I now need to turn my ball joints a further 90 degrees to introduce this correct caster. Then I shouldnt have too much trouble setting camber and toe. As yet it may not be right but at least I now understand what the hell was wrong and why I couldnt get anywhere close.
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Old 23-05-2019, 08:38 AM   #16
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The eccentric nature of the Type 3 ball joints is to set/adjust the camber angle, not the caster angle. The caster angle (which helps with steering self centre) is set by different thicknesses of (now I suppose totally unobtainable) beam mounting rubbers.
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Old 23-05-2019, 09:20 AM   #17
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Only the two ones are used for adjusting the camber. The bottom ball joints should be set in the correct orientation, which is offset rewards and then locked. This sets the correct caster. But should anyone change the bottom ball joint position it will adjust the caster. As a result it would also change the camber and toe too. It's holistic system.
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Old 23-05-2019, 02:41 PM   #18
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Most if not all 'replacement' quality bottom ball joints have no concentric adjustment. They are at a fixed setting.
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Old 23-05-2019, 02:48 PM   #19
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I can't comment on whats currently for sale, but the set of febi which I bought about 4 years ago are eccentric as per the original which I recovered last night. It does seem the issue was my piss poor alignment of them!
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Old 24-05-2019, 08:25 AM   #20
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Glad it was a simple fix then
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